Vic training schools???

[Ranger]

I'm new to the industry and need some advice specifically on Vic training schools.

I've made some initial inquiries and have been getting some mixed and varied opinions on where to train in Victoria.

I'm about to embark on my CPL(H) course full time and like most students want not only the best for my dollar, but want a school who can open up a door into the tourism industry for that first job. I realise that most jobs at this level involve little to no income.

PHS, heli group and kestral are my options. I've heard alot about all three,

All promise that "I will be flying at the rock" after I finish. I realise that they are a business and need develop their business, but all bulls@#t aside, who is the best and who will be the most worth while for employent prosepects?

[helothere]

This is a common question, good on you for seeking some advice from those that have been there.

Firstly, no school is likely to give you a 100% guarantee of employment after training. If they do, get it in writing. If the school does indeed have a path for low time pilots to follow, generally the ones who get a "go" are the students who show themselves worthy during their training. Are you the one who always sticks around to help wash the aircraft? Can you push a broom or wash the coffee cups without needing to be asked? Are you always early and well prepared for theory/flying lessons? Do you have a sense of humour? Are you safety conscious? Do you have any other skills you can offer? Of course these are just examples but you get the idea.

That said, as a new entry to the industry your contacts will be limited. A school with good industry links will certainly help. A good word from someone who knows someone does go a long way in this game. All schools will tell you that they have any amount of industry links but take it with a grain of salt, they are all sales people before you make your decision.

I know this does not answer your question directly. As long as a school teaches you good flying skills and attitudes you will be off to a good start. If you are the right person then you will get there with or without the help of your school. Afterall, once you have your license, unless you really stand out then you are not much use to them anymore, why should they help you?

Hopefully there will be some replies to follow from some who have had direct experience with the schools you mentioned.

[Ranger]

Thanks for the reply mate. One thing I have learnt from speaking to people is that they are somewhat bashfull when it comes to commenting negatively about other schools. I'm not expecting anyone to bag a school, but considering there are a few members in this forum, there must be some varied experiences out there.

[gadget]

don't be discouraged by the lack of responses

you may find that very few will post a reponse, some will without caution if they have been burned by a specific school & have no interest in returning to said establishment.

many may err on the side of caution, as we cannot determine who/what/where you are due to the nature of the anonymity granted in such forum environments most might be reluctant to respond, as their handles may be known by several within the industry. The industry isn't that big, & burning bridges, even shoody ones, can come back & bite you big time.

the question you ask is valid one, but it is also one of the most common methods of schools to determine what an on-line community is saying about them, which (if the reponses are unfavourable) they in turn reciprocate by slagging said site & it's members.

some may have chosen to respond by private message or email, because of the above reasons, but that doesn't eliminate the fact that you may not be whom you portray yourself as (small fish or big fish).

nighty-night

hey i just sprouted another limb!

[Mongrel Dog]

Ive done a bit of training at Kestrel post licence, and would rate them quite highly. I found them to be a well run outfit with friendly and professional instructors.
As for finding work, the industry seems to be the strongest it's been for years. If your prepared to put in the hard yards and are willing to travel around you shouldnt have too many problems.
Good Luck

[skypig]

Obvious Facts (often ignored)

Most schools are good; most have advantages and disadvantages compared to others.
Unless a student has flown with a number of instructors they wont have anything to compare.
Ditto for schools.
So the statement “such and such is a fantastic/crap instructor/school” is often meaningless.
What suits one individual may not suit someone else.

Advice

If practical, spend at least a day at a prospective school, watch how they go about it, and talk to current students.

Don’t pay up front. If you think you could be happier somewhere else, go there and try it, you can always go back (or try a third)

All other things being equal an Instructor who has industry experience and a grade1 rating will be better and worth paying more for.

Your first job will likely involve a Robbo – do a lot of your training in one.

If they tell you that theory by correspondence (we’ll help etc) is the go, don’t believe anything else they say either. Full time professional ground school, taught by someone who is not a freshly qualified commercial pilot is essential.

Generally avoid helicopter schools where the instructors wear epaulettes with gold bars.

If you have to fly the machine (at your expense, and it always ends up at your expense) to the training area, the maintenance facility or the fuel bowser, you are being ripped off.

If you don’t get two hours flying or more most days something is very wrong.

Enjoy the time and don’t rush to get your licence thinking the last job is about to get away.

skypig

[Ranger]

Thanks guys for all the replys

Your feedback is very much appreciated

Ranger

[bellslapper]

Ranger....PHS and Helicopter Group both have bases at the rock, once training is completed in Melbourne, for those lucky few, good chance to get into the industry

[gadget]

have also done some Kestrel training post license- all good,

also flown with a few of their x-students who all seem the right kind of blokes you want to have around working for you.

[heliflyer1]

G'day mate,

I know its been awhile since your last post, just wondering how your flying is going and what school you ended up choosing? How are they and are you nearly finished your course now?

[phugoyd]

Generally avoid helicopter schools where the instructors wear epaulettes with gold bars.

Gees Skypig thats a bit harsh, but i do agree that its the luck of the draw.

You could train with a school where their instructors have done their term and are old and bitter and hate the whole experience or be lucky and get an instructor thats done a year, has something to offer and still enjoys teaching. I had both and hated flying with some of guys who had been there too long and learnt heaps from others who still enjoyed their job.

You really have to look at all the costs as well. Some schools in Vic just keep adding little costs on here and there for everything and others you pay the aircraft hourly rate, flight test and theory and your done. I enjoyed flying at Moorabin as it is close to everything except a confined area.

I would also do an in house theory course or with a theory school as its invaluable to just keep asking questions and not waste time at home barking up the wrong tree.

Some schools will get you to ferry aircraft for maintenance at your cost etc. Get everything you pay for and if you are getting bored get them to teach you more advanced stuff. A big thing i lacked was inflight replanning when under pressure. Keep getting scenarios that test your ability to replan, and know how much fuel you have at all times and also teach you when to make the critical decision that you just cant keep flying and have to land.

Also with the rock, it used to help to have turbine time to get your next job but these days if you can get command time faster in a piston then you can move into many companies without turbine so dont be distracted by that sales pitch these days.

Try them all out, it all goes in your log book.

Good luck

[agent 99]

Be carefull about the turbine hard sell. From my experiences 105 hrs and a turbine endorsment isn't going to help you too much.Employers arn't to keen to let the new kid fly their big shiny turbine pride of the fleet.Best recommendation is start with a r44 endorsment then move up when there is a job garauntee.
My experience with kestrel was a great training school for instructors and the opportunity to do some flying at a cattle station.I was lucky to be able to use their machines after my license to get a bit of joyflight experience but its not given to you on a plate.you have to hold people to there words and get of your bum and find the places to run the joyflights.But generaly with my experience there it was pretty good.
You have to have the best go get them attitude because no one in this industry comes looking for you.
good luck...

[heliflyer1]

jkhkhkhk

[mildformofinsanity]

I've had some experience with PHS and have no complaints.

[heliflyer1]

ghtyredsae

[skywiz]

Ranger,

neither will provide you with any guarantee of employment, if they are being honest, the'll both tell you getting your first job is difficult and be prepared to work for very little (less than $20K PA). I know someone who trained at Heli Gp and secured employment straight away and he was more than happy with his instructors. Others however have not been so lucky and are still looking. Heli GP I understand train fewer pilots than PHS, does this give you a better chance at securing employement with Heli GP? only your attitude, attributes and abilities will determine this come the end of your training. I've also heard Ayers Rock heli boys do more hours in a year than PHS, less pilots per machine.

As for theory, look up Lionel Taylor at Moorabbin, works out of a training room at Binni's flying school, has an excellent reputation and highly recommended.

Best of luck!

[Ranger]

Heliflyer1 and for all those that are concerned....

Without giving my handle away

I train at heligroup - excellent - recommend

Theory - LT - Legend!

Ranger[/b]

[heliflyer1]

Thanks Ranger & skywiz, how far along in your training are you now? I shell look for LT.

[havick]

Did my training at Heli GP at moorabbin about 5 years ago, walked straight into a stint up at the Rock... Same thing is going on now, the instructors have changed, but still quite good and experienced in their own right, most of them are ex-students that got their licence there, and did a stint up in the NT themselves for a few years before heading back to instruct. Keep in mind Heli GP also now have a couple more bases that they are running tourist machines out of, in AUS and overseas, so that opens up more doors for students to move through and build up the hours.

I ended up getting a bunch of R44 time and my 206 endorsement and 5 hours command, genuinely for free (no payment), just in the right place at the right time, before getting my stint up at the rock.