Drone near miss
- Helicoil
- Gold Wings
- Posts: 141
- Joined: Feb 2012
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- 2nd Dan
- Posts: 367
- Joined: Apr 2008
Re: Drone near miss
Only a matter of time until the story lines change to a collision here in Australia.
CA$A (Safer skies?) please take note..
You have already approved BLOS in some areas. WTF.
You're a pack of dickhead$.
GF has vented.
CA$A (Safer skies?) please take note..
You have already approved BLOS in some areas. WTF.
You're a pack of dickhead$.
GF has vented.
There is always an option.
- Twistgrip
- 4th Dan
- Posts: 1169
- Joined: Sep 2006
Re: Drone near miss
GF,
I know of a few drone operators that are pilots themselves, but that isn't the problem. The truth is that drones are accessible by anyone and therein lies the real problem, people with absolutely no regard whatsoever to the rules and I go so far as to say some of them don't and wont give a F#c^ , those types will always be the issue for us. Its a bit like our industry isn't it .
I know of a few drone operators that are pilots themselves, but that isn't the problem. The truth is that drones are accessible by anyone and therein lies the real problem, people with absolutely no regard whatsoever to the rules and I go so far as to say some of them don't and wont give a F#c^ , those types will always be the issue for us. Its a bit like our industry isn't it .
"You can watch things happen, you can make things happen or you can wonder what happened"
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- Gold Wings
- Posts: 108
- Joined: Nov 2013
Re: Drone near miss
Maybe it might be time for AHIA to start pushing their 'weight' around and start pushing for an national advertising campaign similar to the drink driving/speeding/mobile phone adds you see on t.v.?
I know ignorance isn't an excuse but how many of us have seen drones being sold and either the seller or purchaser do not have a clue about the laws?
I personally have many friends that have drones and are clueless when it comes to the legal operation or their legal obligation to drones. Most people genuinely purchase them for a bit of fun and amateur photography without realising the potential threat.
Just a thought...
I know ignorance isn't an excuse but how many of us have seen drones being sold and either the seller or purchaser do not have a clue about the laws?
I personally have many friends that have drones and are clueless when it comes to the legal operation or their legal obligation to drones. Most people genuinely purchase them for a bit of fun and amateur photography without realising the potential threat.
Just a thought...
- FerrariFlyer
- 4th Dan
- Posts: 1543
- Joined: Aug 2006
Re: Drone near miss
Sadly, CASA have let the proverbial horse bolt and put the whole drone/UAV/RPA issue into the too hard basket because of the sheer numbers involved. They have to do much, much more...and fast!
Licenced drone operators (myself included) operate to reasonably high standards and pose little, if any risk to manned aircraft. On the other hand, members of the public continue to purchase drones in record numbers and ignorantly operate them with no regard for safety and/or manned aircraft. I have this week alone heard of 3 incidents with fellow professional pilots who have had close calls including one where a B105 had to take evasive action at nearly 2000ft near Perth recently.
Many of us hope it is not the case however it won't be until a RPT plane from the likes of Qantas or Virgin suffers from some serious or catastrophic collision with a drone that CASA will finally be forced to act. As an industry we should be quite worried about unfettered and unlicenced drone usage. Quite!
Licenced drone operators (myself included) operate to reasonably high standards and pose little, if any risk to manned aircraft. On the other hand, members of the public continue to purchase drones in record numbers and ignorantly operate them with no regard for safety and/or manned aircraft. I have this week alone heard of 3 incidents with fellow professional pilots who have had close calls including one where a B105 had to take evasive action at nearly 2000ft near Perth recently.
Many of us hope it is not the case however it won't be until a RPT plane from the likes of Qantas or Virgin suffers from some serious or catastrophic collision with a drone that CASA will finally be forced to act. As an industry we should be quite worried about unfettered and unlicenced drone usage. Quite!
- fearless_fly
- Silver Wings
- Posts: 34
- Joined: Jul 2010
Re: Drone near miss
So if a drone is operating within the regulations and comes in proximity with a low flying aircraft (<400 AGL') then where does the blame go?
I'm not talking about GA aircraft flying below legal requirements but rather an emergency services machine flying low for operational reasons.
No doubt the media will crucify the drone operator even though he is operating within the rules.
For the record, I'm a drone operator and CPL(H) holder.
I'm not talking about GA aircraft flying below legal requirements but rather an emergency services machine flying low for operational reasons.
No doubt the media will crucify the drone operator even though he is operating within the rules.
For the record, I'm a drone operator and CPL(H) holder.
- hoverthrust
- Gold Wings
- Posts: 152
- Joined: Aug 2010
Re: Drone near miss
Drones seem to be getting more rouge. I wonder what is going to happen after September with the relaxing of some regulations?
I just found this online https://player.vimeo.com/video/91580674
Amazing footage - it is - no doubt highly illegal.
Even tonight on CH 7 tonight
some guy flies a drone over Bondi and they do a fluffy story on it without even thinking it could be illegal footage. I wonder if Channel 7 thinks its illegal or thinks its just nice footage to use ?
I am not against drones. I have even considered getting one myself. I'm against guys out there who make it hard and ruining it for serious people who want to get into it. We have had triathletes injured by them, near misses all over the country. I really fear a serious accident with fatalities will happen and that will be the only thing to make people stand up and do something about it.
I just found this online https://player.vimeo.com/video/91580674
Amazing footage - it is - no doubt highly illegal.
Even tonight on CH 7 tonight
some guy flies a drone over Bondi and they do a fluffy story on it without even thinking it could be illegal footage. I wonder if Channel 7 thinks its illegal or thinks its just nice footage to use ?
I am not against drones. I have even considered getting one myself. I'm against guys out there who make it hard and ruining it for serious people who want to get into it. We have had triathletes injured by them, near misses all over the country. I really fear a serious accident with fatalities will happen and that will be the only thing to make people stand up and do something about it.
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- FerrariFlyer
- 4th Dan
- Posts: 1543
- Joined: Aug 2006
Re: Drone near miss
CASA supposedly trawl YouTube for video footage taken illegally by drones however most within the industry have very little faith in them actually doing something tangible to offenders.
If they haven't the resources to effectively regulate and control the use of drones what hope have they of policing it?
If they haven't the resources to effectively regulate and control the use of drones what hope have they of policing it?
- hoverthrust
- Gold Wings
- Posts: 152
- Joined: Aug 2010
Re: Drone near miss
Something I hadn't though of till a senior pilot brought it up in the hanger. I wonder if as in the above story that Channel 7 did tonight, or for that matter any media, putting to air a story that contains illegal airspace drone footage, or breaking any or many rules, even though it wasn't shot by them. Does that put their own AOC at risk ?
I wonder if the Chief Pilot even knows that a story - seemingly harmless story is about to jeopardise their whole aviation operation ? Or even if he is consulted before it goes to air ?
I wonder if the Chief Pilot even knows that a story - seemingly harmless story is about to jeopardise their whole aviation operation ? Or even if he is consulted before it goes to air ?
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- 2nd Dan
- Posts: 373
- Joined: Jul 2012
Re: Drone near miss
HT,
I doubt there is any risk to the Ch7 AOC.
However, I did watch the footage on the news, and having flown through there a lot I thought of two things.
a) was the drone under 500 feet (hard to imagine looking at the shots and b) it would have been really easy to hit it...and that's what worried me.
Arrrj
I doubt there is any risk to the Ch7 AOC.
However, I did watch the footage on the news, and having flown through there a lot I thought of two things.
a) was the drone under 500 feet (hard to imagine looking at the shots and b) it would have been really easy to hit it...and that's what worried me.
Arrrj
- Jabberwocky
- 3rd Dan
- Posts: 505
- Joined: Dec 2007
Re: Drone near miss
There's drone operations in R405 and the city just about every day according to the Notams.
- Hueyman
- Silver Wings
- Posts: 54
- Joined: Apr 2015
Re: Drone near miss
http://openworksengineering.com/skywall
this is the answer we all have been looking for
this is the answer we all have been looking for
charlie don't surf!
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- 2nd Dan
- Posts: 373
- Joined: Jul 2012
Re: Drone near miss
Jabber,
Great, I have to fly 405 most days (not from BK...). Haven't seen any yet...that's worse !
Huey,
Order for 2, fixed to port and starboard, please !
Are
Great, I have to fly 405 most days (not from BK...). Haven't seen any yet...that's worse !
Huey,
Order for 2, fixed to port and starboard, please !
Are
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- 2nd Dan
- Posts: 367
- Joined: Apr 2008
Re: Drone near miss
This company is on track.
I understand professionals and their objectives, But the others with sinister plans should look out.
http://www.department13.com/
I understand professionals and their objectives, But the others with sinister plans should look out.
http://www.department13.com/
There is always an option.
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- 2nd Dan
- Posts: 367
- Joined: Apr 2008
Re: Drone near miss
In addition to my previous comments.
I have been holding back on expressing some of my opinions and will do my best to remove any emotions.
I fly on a daily basis, low level and at legally prescribed altitudes depending on what areas i have to look after for the given task.
So my main concern is that CA$A have approved my operations below 300ft over land (In non built up areas) and over water (provided i have a Radar Altimeter for over water ops, which i do) and they have approved drones to operate up to 400ft and from what i know, clear of CTA unless approved. (No buffer zone, WHY?)
I have been advised plenty of times by Air Traffic controllers that there is a drone in the vicinity of me in CTA, but they cannot determine exactly where it is in regards to my position.(WTF)
Drones are most commonly small and almost impossible to sight, rendering the situation bloody dangerous.
As mentioned in a previous post, CA$A have recently approved a few operators BLOS (Beyond Line Of Sight) and that just baffles me to think they are helping progress drones, placing them in the path of other manned aircraft and leaving the rest of the industry behind in real aviation, along with all the other restrictions and Part 61 crap that is crippling the GA industry slowly ( another topic..)
I encounter drone operators on a weekly basis, thankfully most of which make basic radio calls but lack accurate descriptions for the area of operation and common pilot feed back. Ie, "yes i have you sighted and i will maintain separation" or " i don't have you sighted, i'm 1 mile east of where ever and i will remain below what ever height"
How do drone operators know how high the drone actually is? (please excuse my lack of tech knowledge..)
I think drone operators need to buff up on these skills. ( Are they being educated enough from the start? and i'm sure if they are CPL holders as well, they would understand where i'm coming from)
Either way, i hold CA$A responsible for making a piss poor effort in implementing and policing the regulations for drone operators. Not enough thought put into the whole process. (Pack of dickhead$)
If you are a professional drone operator, i wish you luck. I have no axe to grind, it is up to you how you earn a living. We just need to avoid exchanging mechanical parts with each other, and how this can be avoided is primarily up to CA$A and you.
Im simply venting and not willing to get into a argument with anyone so please feel free to contribute or comment, but don't get upset when i don't respond.
It's getting too late, GF over and out.
I have been holding back on expressing some of my opinions and will do my best to remove any emotions.
I fly on a daily basis, low level and at legally prescribed altitudes depending on what areas i have to look after for the given task.
So my main concern is that CA$A have approved my operations below 300ft over land (In non built up areas) and over water (provided i have a Radar Altimeter for over water ops, which i do) and they have approved drones to operate up to 400ft and from what i know, clear of CTA unless approved. (No buffer zone, WHY?)
I have been advised plenty of times by Air Traffic controllers that there is a drone in the vicinity of me in CTA, but they cannot determine exactly where it is in regards to my position.(WTF)
Drones are most commonly small and almost impossible to sight, rendering the situation bloody dangerous.
As mentioned in a previous post, CA$A have recently approved a few operators BLOS (Beyond Line Of Sight) and that just baffles me to think they are helping progress drones, placing them in the path of other manned aircraft and leaving the rest of the industry behind in real aviation, along with all the other restrictions and Part 61 crap that is crippling the GA industry slowly ( another topic..)
I encounter drone operators on a weekly basis, thankfully most of which make basic radio calls but lack accurate descriptions for the area of operation and common pilot feed back. Ie, "yes i have you sighted and i will maintain separation" or " i don't have you sighted, i'm 1 mile east of where ever and i will remain below what ever height"
How do drone operators know how high the drone actually is? (please excuse my lack of tech knowledge..)
I think drone operators need to buff up on these skills. ( Are they being educated enough from the start? and i'm sure if they are CPL holders as well, they would understand where i'm coming from)
Either way, i hold CA$A responsible for making a piss poor effort in implementing and policing the regulations for drone operators. Not enough thought put into the whole process. (Pack of dickhead$)
If you are a professional drone operator, i wish you luck. I have no axe to grind, it is up to you how you earn a living. We just need to avoid exchanging mechanical parts with each other, and how this can be avoided is primarily up to CA$A and you.
Im simply venting and not willing to get into a argument with anyone so please feel free to contribute or comment, but don't get upset when i don't respond.
It's getting too late, GF over and out.
There is always an option.
- Eric Hunt
- 3rd Dan
- Posts: 914
- Joined: Sep 2006
Re: Drone near miss
Whenever I see one of those travel programs sponsored by European river cruises, there is always some drone footage in there - the channel must pay for a drone operator to be on the tour (or it is a freebie for the promotional value). The video is wonderful, though, the view zooming up and away from the boat and around the local village.
Wonder how EASA deals with the drones?
Wonder how EASA deals with the drones?
- hoverthrust
- Gold Wings
- Posts: 152
- Joined: Aug 2010
Re: Drone near miss
Very well said godfather007.
I encounter the blunt end of the drone industry - often.
Something that I would have been employed for - now can be done by a drone - or so they think.
Dont mind that my helicopter has 50 EO and STC to attach things to it.
The guys at the power line companies and media - just don't care. They are prepared to give a drone a go
until it all falls over then they call in the chopper.
That is currently what makes me mad. That first call is now a drone and when it falls over lets pay more for a real chopper.
It is progress i guess some call it.
The risk
I wonder if anyone puts in their fancy risk assessments - threat; drone - likelihood; probable - outcome; catastrophic ??
The risk is high. I guess its like the Uber of the GA industry. Disruption. I just hope that we all don't go out of business.
It is bizarre that there rant buffers from CA$A. I liken it to making a pedestrian crossings on a freeways.
first you would say - thats not safe
second - health and safety wouldn't allow it past the lips of those who made the suggestion.
I'm afraid it will take a nasty incident hopefully not an airline to make changes.
I believe both industries can work together, but there is a reason that we have engineers and 50 EO/STC to make things safe over the heads of people. If we were crashing helicopters into the pylon of the harbour bridge every week all helicopters would be grounded. full stop.
I encounter the blunt end of the drone industry - often.
Something that I would have been employed for - now can be done by a drone - or so they think.
Dont mind that my helicopter has 50 EO and STC to attach things to it.
The guys at the power line companies and media - just don't care. They are prepared to give a drone a go
until it all falls over then they call in the chopper.
That is currently what makes me mad. That first call is now a drone and when it falls over lets pay more for a real chopper.
It is progress i guess some call it.
The risk
I wonder if anyone puts in their fancy risk assessments - threat; drone - likelihood; probable - outcome; catastrophic ??
The risk is high. I guess its like the Uber of the GA industry. Disruption. I just hope that we all don't go out of business.
It is bizarre that there rant buffers from CA$A. I liken it to making a pedestrian crossings on a freeways.
first you would say - thats not safe
second - health and safety wouldn't allow it past the lips of those who made the suggestion.
I'm afraid it will take a nasty incident hopefully not an airline to make changes.
I believe both industries can work together, but there is a reason that we have engineers and 50 EO/STC to make things safe over the heads of people. If we were crashing helicopters into the pylon of the harbour bridge every week all helicopters would be grounded. full stop.
- FerrariFlyer
- 4th Dan
- Posts: 1543
- Joined: Aug 2006
Re: Drone near miss
Outcome of NTSB investigations into drone vs helicopter collision near New York City (they actually found the drone pilot):
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/201 ... -in-rotor/
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/201 ... -in-rotor/
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- 2nd Dan
- Posts: 330
- Joined: May 2016
Re: Drone near miss
ASSURE UAS Airborne Collision Severity Evaluation Final Report
http://www.assureuas.org/projects/deliv ... Report.php
Regards,
http://www.assureuas.org/projects/deliv ... Report.php
Regards,
'Mankind has a perfect record in aviation - we have never left one up there!'
- Evil Twin
- 3rd Dan
- Posts: 696
- Joined: Mar 2007
Re: Drone near miss
FerrariFlyer wrote:Outcome of NTSB investigations into drone vs helicopter collision near New York City (they actually found the drone pilot):
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/201 ... -in-rotor/
Send him an invoice, that might make the muppets think before droning, though probably not.
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